Obama's Spiritual Advisor in Iran

Pastor Joel Hunter with Isfahan Governor.

 

In a bid to establish some good will and reach out to a country the United States is negotiating with but has been largely cut off from for over three decades, the Florida pastor Joel Hunter recently led a group of American religious leaders to Iran to meet an array of politicians and clerics. Hunter, who leads Northland Church in Florida, is also a spiritual advisor to President Barack Obama, and is due to brief the president on his visit, which included meetings with senior figures in both Iran’s political and religious establishment. Hunter talks to IranWire about his trip, and how interfaith delegations can fill a public diplomacy gap and create the sort of extra-political, personal ties that for much of the twentieth century remained crucial to the two countries’ good relations.

 

Can you tell us a bit about how this trip came about?

Several of us have been building a relationship with Iranian ayatollahs and scholars for years. Our usual meeting place is in Switzerland, we meet there a couple of times a year– and these talks always include Jews, Muslims, and Christians from both the United States and Iran. Out of that relationship we were invited by Iranian religious leaders and scholars to participate in a symposium on how to build a world free from religious violence and extremism. We went to Iran to participate in that, but also had several folks we needed to meet in Tehran, Qom, and Isfahan.

 

Who did you meet in Qom? What were their concerns, attitudes?

We were warmly received by several political officials. We met with high level religious advisors, including an advisor to the Supreme Leader and grand ayatollahs, and the rector of Islamic seminaries in Qom, leading academics, members of the Iranian Academy of Sciences and Academy of Philosophy, and also other religious leaders of the largest Christian communities, the Armenian archbishop, the leader of the Evangelical Church of Iran and also Jewish leaders, the chairman of the Jewish association, the Iranian Islamic Human Rights Commission, and people who were just walking by on the street, just citizens who we enjoyed talking to.

 

How did this assortment of officials and religious leaders view the relationship with the United States and Iran’s place in the world?

My estimation of what they’re perceiving is that Iran is different than any other country in the Middle East, it is a very educated country, and Shia Islam takes great stock in reason and logic. But it is a country that identifies itself in religious terms, its leadership is religious, and so a faith- based approach is absolutely necessary to build trust between countries and religions. Both sides recognized that trust is zero right now when it comes to politics. The U.S. is a very religious country, so it stands to reason that trust would be built between religious leaders who want to honor God, and make the moral component a very important part of a discussion between the two countries.

 

What was your perception of Iran’s leaders before going, and did that change?

I am guilty of being too influenced by the media of malice. I think both of our countries have listened to media outlets that promote caricatures of our governments’ leadership rather than people who are really trying to serve well. So I was very impressed with Iranians officials, not because they were so polite and saying what I wanted to hear, but because they were very open about some of the challenges, and were very receptive, people of reason who truly wanted a better relationship and understanding. There’s an old staying: if you want to increase your knowledge, buy a book; if you want to increase your understanding, buy a ticket. Nothing I could have read would have done what this trip did for us.

 

I know this wasn’t a human rights trip, but surely issues like the persecution of religious minorities came up. How receptive were officials and clerics to those conversations? Did they see that as a niggling side issue or were they taking it seriously?

We felt like we were taken very seriously. We wanted to make a plea for Pastor Abedini’s clemency, and they said, this is how you do it, and made a way for us to do that. The details need to remain unspoken, but they told us about where that decision around [Pastor Abedini] would be made, told us to write a letter with these aspects, and said we will deliver it to this person. The person who delivered it we know and trust, and know that he delivered [that letter] in the best possible light. We were satisfied that not only were they open, but wanted to make the best connection that they could.

 

Can you talk briefly about your relationship with President Obama and whether you’ll be briefing him on this visit?

I am spiritual advisor to the president and will be speaking with him. I was at the White House yesterday sharing impressions and hopes with their Iran team, and giving what we thought was a very good report about our visit. We wanted to share with them some of the openness and good will that is available right now, and encourage them to do whatever they can to also act in good will. So yes, there’s a lot of direct conversations with people who will be dealing with Iran–there are no policy recommendations, because we don’t do that, but [we were] trying to create some of  optimism that hasn’t been there before.

 

Did you have a sense that the Iranians you spoke to were open to the prospect of opening bilateral relations with the United States?

We admitted our ignorance of one other’s country and religion. Americans are really not aware of our interventions in Iranian history as a general rule, and that those [interventions] have been a source of hurt and frustration for Iranians. We also recognize that most of our interactions are political negotiations and not interactions of personal appreciation. Political negotiation is about trying to gain and win, and before you get there, relationships are needed that extend charity and respect. There is an openness right now and a great hope with Rouhani’s administration that some progress can be made. Hopefully we can build some of the foundations for peace.

 

Do you see Congress as obstructing this potential progress, with all the obstacles it throws in the way of the Obama administration’s diplomacy?

You’re right that Congress constructs layers of sanctions tied to certain actions or behavior. But we will be  following up with Congresspeople and trying to share with them our hopes for better relations, not just connected to the nuclear negotiations, which have happily come down to mechanics, with both sides willing to cooperate on the big points. Overall this is a long road, and we want to move towards benefiting those whom sanctions have hurt. That  comes down to the poor, who suffer most when government programs are cut. As religious leaders we have a special heart for the most vulnerable, so we want to find a way, even as the sanctions are sustained, to be compassionate. I’m not a policy wonk, but there has to be a way that we can not abrogate the ideals of who we are as a nation and leave it to just the politics of coercion.

 

What do you think is the biggest political and social misconception about Iran?

That Iran’s main goal is to destroy Israel, that Ayatollah Khamenei is an evil person, that Iranians are hostile to the United States. People see the “Death to Americans” demonstrations, and that’s what remains. But that’s not Iran. I believe religious leaders there are peaceful, devout people who want to obey God and that the general [Iranian] population likes the American people. They don’t trust our government, which is totally understandable, a lot of us don’t trust our government, but I think the misconception is that we are natural enemies. We’re not, we’re natural friends and have so much in common– we value our faith, we are patriotic. We have a shared love of our country, high regard for education, and high respect for people who are devout. With more news that has a more comprehensive picture of two countries, the general impression or narrative we have of each other’s country could change significantly.

 

What role can interfaith relations play in promoting dialogue? Are there examples that come to mind, in other conflicts, where religious dialogue has helped defuse tensions?

In the Republic of the Congo, during the devastating war between Muslims and Christians there, we sent over an interfaith delegation to talk to religious leaders. This was behind the scenes, and we were there to say please don’t make this about two religions warring against each other, and that you can, on the basis of your religion, relent of this violence and go to the highest ideals of your religion. And the recent videos of the Pope gathering Mahmoud Abbas and the Israeli leader, just for prayer, was just a wonderful picture of how interfaith and religious leaders can lead the way in politics, not being bound like politicians who just can’t go there yet.

 

How did you find Iranians, and Iran as a country?

A shop owner in Isfahan asked me where we [were] from. When I said from the U.S., he said “I hope you’ll come back, not because I want to sell you something, but because I want to be friends with you”. I wasn’t even buying anything in his shop, he had no reason to say that other than because it was true, and it really touched my heart.

 

Have you been attacked in the U.S. media, accused of visiting a vile country and pandering to its leadership?

There are hardliners in both countries, and those of us who want to build new bridges know that we’re going to get blamed and criticized, that our visit is going to be politicized and that some will use it for their own benefit. There are industries built on suspicion and cynicism, and we understand that. But that’s how you make progress, not by pandering to those critics, but building something better.